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Post by lordofdragons on Apr 6, 2015 2:55:56 GMT -5
The presence of the robots.txt file in the Zoids Poison domain tells me that he was likely aware service was going to lapse, and possibly refrained from warning people to prevent copy cats. He seems very adamant about not letting the site be brought back under someone else's ownership, which I can understand, but it's a shame. It's also likely why he didn't give people warning. Chances are someone would've just ripped the ZP data and rehosted the site after it shut down. Where we are then back at the legal problem. He owns the forum but he does not own the "content posted by the users". So preventing people from ripping the content would be pure legally spoken an illegal act. So one way or the other he didn't shower himself with fame in this act.
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Post by Maethius on Apr 6, 2015 9:49:02 GMT -5
Final answer, I suppose: let's make Pheno's the very best it can be!
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Post by Darth Escargot on Apr 6, 2015 11:06:06 GMT -5
I seriously doubt you could make the case that we're entitled to access/ownership of anything we posted on ZP. Liem hosted it with no guarantees that it would be there forever - if I had wanted to keep my stuff, I should've saved it locally. Plus all of the content is derivative and riddled with TT and Kotobukiya trademarks anyway. If this really went down the way it looks like it did, it's just a classless move on Liem's part and not much else. I just don't understand it. If he doesn't want to run the site anymore, why does he feel so strongly about it that it's only either him or the site dies altogether? And even if that made sense, we could've salvaged the content and hosted it under a new name, if that's what he wanted. Sigh. Anyway, I guess we're here now.
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Post by lordofdragons on Apr 6, 2015 12:20:59 GMT -5
I seriously doubt you could make the case that we're entitled to access/ownership of anything we posted on ZP. Liem hosted it with no guarantees that it would be there forever - if I had wanted to keep my stuff, I should've saved it locally. Plus all of the content is derivative and riddled with TT and Kotobukiya trademarks anyway. If this really went down the way it looks like it did, it's just a classless move on Liem's part and not much else. I just don't understand it. If he doesn't want to run the site anymore, why does he feel so strongly about it that it's only either him or the site dies altogether? And even if that made sense, we could've salvaged the content and hosted it under a new name, if that's what he wanted. Sigh. Anyway, I guess we're here now. Over access one can dispute but not over ownership. Of course if foreign material is reused, modified or otherwise work over that's no more the legal property of the person in question. The forum though contained a lot of information gathered together and processed. That's a lot of effort that somebody mustered up. Of course you can back it up but do you really back up a large discussion with potentially additional value to it to your hard drive? The original content yes but the content that build around it? Furthermore the forum contained a lot of custom builds of people in various shapes of presentation. Of course the builds are at home somewhere and could be re-pictured but all the stuff around it like the topic with all the media, infos what not else is a lot of work somebody mustered up. This does belong 100% to the person that created it no matter if the canon it is based upon is foreign IP or not. No matter if this could be legally pulled through or not it's a question of how much you value the work of others (or not) that you can wipe out with a flick of the finger.
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Post by Hanyoutai on Apr 6, 2015 18:43:29 GMT -5
I'm not as confident in the legality of that. You usually forfeit any legal rights you have to access forum content when you sign up. You do own your content, yes, but that does not legally obligate an individual to host it completely free of charge for you and ZP was not contractually a storage service. By being hosted by Proboards Phenotype also has the right to completely shut down or revoke your access. It also has a no warranties and no responsibility for loss of data section.
I feel horrible about the situation but also know from experience that people will often blatantly ignore an admin's request not to rehost. At least we got most of the important topics, much thanks to Falcarius and his meticulous attention to detail. ... For what it's worth if TIB ever goes down for more than a few days, knock yourselves out ripping/rehosting whatever you want.
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Post by furys12 on Apr 6, 2015 19:24:52 GMT -5
Just to clear something up, the robots.txt protocol is nothing more then a search engine directory, it essentially tells search engines whats at a site and how to find it within the site, it can also be used to tell search engines where to ignore in search results, you use this to keep your private sections (members only, admins only etc) from showing up in search results, nearly every site in existence would have a robots.txt and it definitely doesn't point to any nefarious happenings
that said its still a *Watch your language!* move to let a community driven site lapse and disappear from existence, its hard to say who owns what without reading the eula for a specific site but its pretty much guaranteed that you have no rights to anything posted on ZP (or anywhere else), if you want to make sure your content stays yours, post it elsewhere and link to it, you cant do that for text really though so yeah, you could sue someone for content rights and in all likely hood no one is going to go to court over that and youll get YOUR stuff back, but i highly highly doubt any forum/site eula would be setup in such a way that gave a random member the right to all the content.
sad situation that (apparently) one person feels the need to own a community so badly he'd rather see it die then continue on without him at the helm but thems the breaks
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Post by Hanyoutai on Apr 6, 2015 19:30:29 GMT -5
It's not the presence of it but the fact that it disallows webarchive to crawl the site that made me suspicious. Most sites remain accessible at the front page at least, even if they have private directories. I thought you had to specifically request that Webarchive not turn up results? It'd be interesting to know if this isn't the case, to at least put that to rest.
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Post by Leon35 on Apr 6, 2015 19:35:30 GMT -5
I can understand 1000% why he didn't want the site anymore. IF he was done with Zoids, so be it. His life.
What I am not sure I get is why he just couldn't let us know or hand over the site. The forum grew beyond him. I wish he could have respected that a bit more. What a waste to see years of information gone without any notice. If he wasn't willing to let someone else be admin of the site and pay the bill, then he should have given us a notification for the sake of archiving stuff and moving over to Phenotype.
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Post by commandliger on Apr 29, 2015 7:03:50 GMT -5
Well now...I haven't had time to check Zoids Poison since my last contribution to that site last Jan. Nursing school sucks. But my finals were last Thurs, and I did absolutely nothing last Fri, Sat, Sun. This past Mon I had a job interview for my dream job- work as a nurse in a surgical unit. I got it!! Whoot whoot!! I have been going to school pretty regularly since Seot 2010 (LPN program was from Sept 27, 2010-Dec 16 2011). When in that program I rotated through the surgical department many times and fell in love with it. And yet, the hospital wouldn't consider me! Said "Come back when you are an RN." Never have understood then why the hospital allows LPN students to rotate through areas that wont hire them?! So cruel. Anyway I started working towards my RN beginning the Fall 2012 semester. I quit working last August when I realized there was no way I could work and do clinicals and class. As a last treat to myself, I won the Hasbro Limited Blade blade liger this Jan. And I posted that on ZP. HUGE thank you to the member who posted that on this forum as well. Glad that was preserved. I am sad tho that my collection photos were lost. Guess that means I'll have to update those. Needed to anyway honestly. BUT DAMN IT ALL WHAT HAPPENED TO ZP WHILE I WAS GONE?! I miss ZP. I have a membership with this forum- its actually where I began. Then I got introduced to ZP by someone on here, loved ZP and just stayed there. Seems strange to be back "home." Now that I am going to be working again, I can resume eBay stalking Its been a while since that Hasbro limited blade liger. Of course, since I didn't exactly take time to build zoids while in school, other than the Hasbro limited blade liger, my collection has been back logged. Got a good 10-12 to build. Just relieved school is done so I can live again! But gosh this whole business with ZP leaves a bitter taste in my mouth.
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Post by Maethius on Apr 30, 2015 15:38:15 GMT -5
Well, it's great that you're back and that you landed your Zoid funding system... I mean, dream job! Congrats on all fronts!
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Post by commandliger on Apr 30, 2015 17:01:48 GMT -5
LOL Thanks Maethius. Cant get much better tho, dream job + as you said, zoids funding system Just wish good ol ZP was still up and kicking. That was THE place to be. I mean yes I started on Phenos but well, I cannot even recall when or why I left Phenos the last time. But it was years ago. Oh well. I am just grateful we have a place to still discuss our favorite hobby! And even more glad that I recognize many folks from ZP here on Phenos! And we have the chance to make new zoids pals on here- those people who are "regulars" here on this forum.
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Post by Shizuhara on May 4, 2015 16:39:39 GMT -5
Oh.
Well I guess that explains that. I suppose I shall lurk here instead, now.
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Post by SkyKnight on May 4, 2015 21:26:56 GMT -5
Have been gone from Zoids for quite a while, and this is the not the news that I want to hear about. I do have fond memories of ZP, and let Doc be, as none of us can understand his situation, but I do wish he could have talked to some of Zoiders before letting ZP die off.
Well, how do every Zoiders go on from here? Will there be custom contest? Latest hauls around the world and detailed reviews done by passionate Zoiders will be missed.
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Post by ozzlander on May 4, 2015 22:48:07 GMT -5
Hi all im ozzlander from Zp the weather clears here and i comep back with new customs to find the site down tho at least i found you all here
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Post by Maethius on May 5, 2015 19:26:00 GMT -5
On contests, there is a thread, but there hasn't been enough interest at the present time.
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