|
|
Post by Darth Escargot on Apr 5, 2020 11:22:38 GMT -5
The Murasame Ligers though? They're clunky bricks that were overall just very unsatisfying. They cut corners (like using stickers for important visual features like the mane), the gimmicks take away from some of the actual key visual gimmicks (the sword rotating to both sides), and they take away one of the main joys of Zoids: Actually building it. Oh jeez, I forgot about the stickers. But yeah, I agree with you on all of that, obviously. I got the Murasame Liger when it came out and then never even thought about getting the followup variants, although I have to say they were also getting increasingly uglier and I've never been a big fan of ligers to begin with. It's weird, too, that the protagonist Zoid would get this treatment when a lot of the other stuff in the Genesis line was actually really good. I mean, if they wanted to cut back on R&D cost, they could've just used the original Liger frame and slapped some new armor on it. The ZA figures probably just didn't sell that well. After I saw your post I took a quick look on eBay and found exactly one. If they're all gone... that means nobody bought them. They were definitely good for what they were, though, I just don't really do action figures anymore. |
|
|
|
Post by Snowflake on Apr 5, 2020 18:41:21 GMT -5
Hey Mugen Liger was good.
Why are people acting like 1/72 is a new scale for the genesis ligers??
|
|
|
|
Post by Darth Escargot on Apr 5, 2020 18:47:54 GMT -5
Hey Mugen Liger was good. Why are people acting like 1/72 is a new scale for the genesis ligers?? Sure, if by "good" you mean "fugly"  Sorry, Mugen/Hayate just weren't my thing. Too cluttered, and not in a good way. I don't think anyone's saying 1/72 is a new scale, but the only 1/72 scale models available so far have been the long-OOP Tomy ones that are hard to come by - the ZA figures were 1/100. So more than anything this Supernova model will be a comparatively cheap way to get a Murasame that's to scale with everything else. |
|
|
|
Post by bladeligerzero94 on Apr 5, 2020 19:25:36 GMT -5
I hope Kotobukiya does a REAL HMM Murasame Liger in the future.
|
|
|
|
Post by Hanyoutai on Apr 5, 2020 20:20:01 GMT -5
Yeah, it's not that it's a new scale, it's that the scale was severely lacking for this Zoid. Even when Genesis was new, people wanted a lot more out of the Murasame Liger than we ultimately got. The ZA design really delivers, and now that it's in 1/72 (even if unofficially), it's the perfect Murasame.
Though I'll admit Mugen was a lot better than the Murasame. The design made it more adaptable to being like the show and the mane consisted of 2-part pieces, doing away with the sticker complaints. I don't have a basic Hayate to compare though, only the DVD one, and don't remember its build as well. Those memories are clouded by salt from losing one of the blades.
I would love an official one, but it seems very unlikely at this point. Koto is going strong though, so who knows!
|
|
|
|
Post by Ernestotaku on Apr 6, 2020 5:39:59 GMT -5
I am against buying knock offs unless it’s not somthing officially released like this murasame or the weird bt jager/Schneider combo This. Also, when is almost impossible to buy the original kit or replacements... I mean, as long as we don't harm the original company. Buying a Kotobukiya or Takara TOMY KO of actual models is bad, buying a KO of a StarZeta... OK, not giong to harm FEBER at all. |
|
|
|
Post by Snowflake on Apr 6, 2020 15:18:40 GMT -5
Hey Mugen Liger was good. Why are people acting like 1/72 is a new scale for the genesis ligers?? the ZA figures were 1/100. So more than anything this Supernova model will be a comparatively cheap way to get a Murasame that's to scale with everything else. Ohh okay, it's the ZA stuff making people say that. I get it. I never keep up on those. I vastly preferred the weird stuff like the blox versions of larger zoids, even if that made little sense, they were still in scale. also I agree if it's impossible or unreasonable to buy something properly, nobody can really complain if you give someone else your money. They're filling a niche. In practice, though, third party toys are usually ALSO impossibly expensive |
|
|
|
Post by dchan on Apr 6, 2020 23:31:54 GMT -5
As someone who works in the toy industry, I'm probably overly sensitive about these issues. But I do think it's worth considering that all unlicensed or unofficial products can be harmful or at least unfair in some way. Of course straight-up knockoffs are bad. But a scaled up ZA kit, for example, means someone is still profiting off of Kotobukiya's designers and modelers' work without crediting or paying them. Even unlicensed Transformers, designed from scratch, I see as potentially disrespectful to the companies that put time and effort into doing things properly and legally. I know not everyone cares about harming (giant, faceless) corporations like Bandai or TT, but it can hurt smaller companies or the individuals who contribute to official products. I think that's part of why legit 3rd party releases are often expensive, like the ThreeZero Zoids or Flame Toys Transformers. Even Koto I think is technically 3rd party since they are licensing Zoids through Takara Tomy.
I'm not saying I judge everyone who buys unlicensed things. This Supernova Murasame IS cool, and I'm curious to see what it's like in hand. I've bought knockoffs before but have made an effort to not do so for a while now. I just want to make the distinction that fan art, one-offs, etc are one thing, and copying and mass producing off of others' work is another.
|
|
|
|
Post by Hanyoutai on Apr 7, 2020 2:39:57 GMT -5
You're right on that. It's ultimately something that comes down to individual decision. I'll buy stuff that's in different colors (I don't paint) or a different mold, but for stuff that has an official counterpart, I always go with the official. Of course, I also confess that buying a knockoff of any variety is harmful in some way. The ZA series is done (far as we know) and has never had a single legit re-release, so official channels for those are closed, but it's still not respectful to the designers, etc. It's always good to have a reminder of these things every now and then.
Quality wise, people have been giving it good reviews. Will be building mine over the next few days, but waiting for sunlight to get photos of everything as-is out of the box first.
|
|
|
|
Post by Darth Escargot on Apr 7, 2020 5:44:25 GMT -5
Ethically it's all a bit murky to me. With any kind of product where the money goes straight to the artist or if it's a small company, it's clear that you're basically taking food off of someone's table. I accidentally bought a recast of a Kow Yokoyama Ma.K figure last year because I didn't know what I was getting, and I still feel dirty.
But it's hard to see that when it's multinational corporations like Bandai Namco or Takara Tomy. For one thing, I don't know the ins and outs of anyone's employment contracts, but I'd be very, very surprised if the artists involved weren't on a salary with a contract that stipulates any ideas they have automatically become company property. So in those cases, with straight knockoffs it's mostly just a matter of quality to me. Why would I buy a crappy knockoff kit with bad parts fit if I can just get the real thing?
When it comes to things like this 1/100 Murasame Liger or some of the Gunpla that companies like Supernova or Dragon Momoko have made where it's a design that the actual license holder has not made a model of, the question to me becomes, if there's so much money in this design, why don't they just make an official one? Clearly whatever suits decide what kits/toys get made don't think there's money in this particular design anyway.
At the same time, we all have our budgets - if the SN Murasame Liger didn't exist, would you have spent that money on a Kotobukiya kit? And if that's the case, hasn't the existence of that kit actually taken money away from Kotobukiya after all?
So I dunno. All I have is a Mechanicore kit that I still haven't finished, and some unlicensed Gunpla add-on parts. I generally don't trust companies that make illegitimate products, and I've still just never seen anything except that one MC kit that I really felt like I just had to have.
|
|
|
|
Post by dchan on Apr 7, 2020 12:27:19 GMT -5
Yeah, I doubt Zoids have too many issues with bootlegs and the like. I bet it's a much bigger problem with Gunpla and with action figures (Figma or SH Figuarts especially). I know most members here support the heck out of Takara Tomy or Koto's kits anyway, but I did want to say something nonetheless.
As an aside, the words "Supernova Murasame" form an awesome name, right up there with "Bloody Death Saurer" or my favorite, "Krark Prince of Darkness".
|
|
|
|
Post by Snowflake on Apr 7, 2020 15:28:46 GMT -5
I mean, Transformers was BUILT on using someone else's designs, only some of which were licensed properly. The best thing to do if someone makes an inferior product is warn everyone that it's inferior, and if they make a superior product, hire them. But most decisions of this nature aren't made by the company or any real person protecting their IP, but by lawyers protecting their retainer fees
|
|
