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Post by Maethius on Jul 7, 2010 14:50:46 GMT -5
Well.... saw it... my wife didn't up and leave after five minutes, so I guess that's something. We are big fans of the show and were so hopeful. So... very... hopeful....
After the tears and lawsuits for emotional damages, I'm sure we'll be fine!
Anyone see it?
Incidentally, I found it really interesting as we are reviewing the series that not only did Cameron's "Avatar" kinda steal the thunder (and the name) from Airbender (yes, I know that the word has existed a long time before television and movies... it was a timing issue), but there are a few other similarities I noticed. For instance:
1) In the giant swamp episode of Book 2: Earth, we see an enormous tree very similar to the enormous tree in JC's Avatar.
2) We learn that the entire swamp and surrounding forest is, in fact, this same tree, and that all ecosystems are physically linked together.
3) We learn that Ang (not "Ong" as it is pronounced in Airbender) can "plug in" to the tree and "see" through this union to places and times, just like the tree/life connection in JC's Avatar.
Seems to me that Mr. Cameron was either a big fan of the series or the universe is full of some incredibly coincidences!
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Post by Tilly on Jul 7, 2010 15:58:35 GMT -5
This movie is almost everything I could ever hate about the movie industry in a nice little ball. It's a racist, whitewashed, poorly-executed pile of FAIL, and its director and casting people were all bad kinds of oblivious.
So no, I haven't seen it. I wouldn't even rent it for free, because that'd be somehow giving it sales/renting/'borrowing' on the internet figures. I did go grab the artbook for the original series, though.
(But how do you really feel, Tilly :p?)
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Shadow
Corporal
Professional lurker
Posts: 117
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Post by Shadow on Jul 7, 2010 19:40:25 GMT -5
I have no desire to watch this film, either.
I support the original series, tho, which I love dearly.
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Post by adamassc on Jul 7, 2010 21:18:06 GMT -5
Come on, guys. You make it sound like any movie made based off something we love is a massive failure from the get-go.
I mean, look at Ghost Rider, Resident Evil, and Transformers.
Those three movie series were UNBEARABLY TITANIC failures that made me curl up into a ball and weep for three weeks, four days, six hours, and twentythree minutes.
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Post by Tilly on Jul 7, 2010 22:09:19 GMT -5
I like good movie adaptations just fine; hell, one of my all-time favorite movies is a booktomovie (Watership Down). And I like reboot Trek, and new Doctor Who...
I don't like stuff that's wasting one of the best chances in a while to get some not-white hero action on the screen (and some young actors a chance to get a career going in a biased industry). I mean, seriously, everything has problems, but Failbender's been one big ongoing mess, way back to the beginning. If your casting people are saying things like "if you're Korean, wear a kimono" and you honestly think Avatar is totally culturally ambiguous (and that that means "cast all white people as the main cast except for the bad guy after your white dude backs out"), you should not be goin' anywhere near something that's rolling in East Asian cultural stuff.
This stuff hurts people. It's not cool. And this movie, done right, would have been a great example of NOT needing a bunch of white dudes running around to sell well. Thus, it's a big point of frustration for a lot of people, myself included.
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Post by adamassc on Jul 7, 2010 22:20:28 GMT -5
I like good movie adaptations just fine; hell, one of my all-time favorite movies is a booktomovie (Watership Down). And I like reboot Trek, and new Doctor Who... I don't like stuff that's wasting one of the best chances in a while to get some not-white hero action on the screen (and some young actors a chance to get a career going in a biased industry). I mean, seriously, everything has problems, but Failbender's been one big ongoing mess, way back to the beginning. If your casting people are saying things like "if you're Korean, wear a kimono" and you honestly think Avatar is totally culturally ambiguous (and that that means "cast all white people as the main cast except for the bad guy after your white dude backs out"), you should not be goin' anywhere near something that's rolling in East Asian cultural stuff. This stuff hurts people. It's not cool. And this movie, done right, would have been a great example of NOT needing a bunch of white dudes running around to sell well. Thus, it's a big point of frustration for a lot of people, myself included. Yeah, I see your point. Lady Tilly. M night could've tried a lot harder on this one, considering that he claims to be a big fan.(You would think a 'big fan' would know how to pronounce Aang's name) Shamylong was interviewed about the casting and was very proud of the choices he made, even talking about how great it was that the kid who plays Aang was hired based off a DVD he mailed in. i like Avatar too. The show has some great moments in it. I've heard the movie avoids the humorous aspect. Is this true? Also this: headtripcomics.comicgenesis.com/d/20100312.html
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Post by Tilly on Jul 8, 2010 2:18:28 GMT -5
Who needs humor when you have SERIOUS BUSINESS? (From what I've heard, mostly.)
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Post by KAndrw on Jul 8, 2010 2:45:31 GMT -5
Seems to me that Mr. Cameron was either a big fan of the series or the universe is full of some incredibly coincidences! Or that both products were penned by people who liked their Norse mythology!
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Post by Chuckles on Jul 8, 2010 3:06:03 GMT -5
Or banyan trees.
I haven't seen the film myself, but given the reactions people have been having, I actually feel bad for the piece and everyone involved.
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Post by Tilly on Jul 8, 2010 3:30:40 GMT -5
I don't feel one bit of bad for the director/casting people/etc. They brought it on themselves. Same with Jackson Rathbone, who was all "omg I can just get a tan and it'll be okay". Fff.
I do, however, feel bad for Dev Patel. And Noah Ringer. He's gonna forever have this haunting his resume D:.
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Post by Maethius on Jul 8, 2010 10:54:23 GMT -5
This movie is almost everything I could ever hate about the movie industry in a nice little ball. It's a racist, whitewashed, poorly-executed pile of FAIL, and its director and casting people were all bad kinds of oblivious. ROFLMAO! Tilly, you have a way to put my feelings on the matter into perfect focus. Incidentally, I do see what they were trying to do by casting races of people to represent the nations, and I'm okay with that after a fashion. It's actually a staple of the original series... to a point. BUT, the way it was done was terrible. After all, in the series the Fire Nation are all extremely pale skinned and the Southern Water Tribe appear more Polynesian. Still, hurts to recall the movie for comparison. :D
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Post by visher on Jul 8, 2010 12:01:32 GMT -5
I, like most, am a big fan of the series but didn't particularly like the movie. But one thing that I don't find as a negative thing is Aang's pronunciation change. M. Night stated that it was because the actual asian pronunciation would be 'Ong'. As an Indian, I can see why that change was made. The double a sound is suppossed to make an "ah". That literary rule is not only present in normal english, but especially emphasised in Asian languages. I am not trying to flame anybody or put people down, I'm just adding in some facts. As for the racial issuea, I can agree. They should have casted the water nation as Inuits, as that's what they were based on in the show. The fire nation is I guess probably east asian/Indonesian, as some appear to be chinese/japanese while others later in the series are a bit darker. Air nomads, albeit straying in appearance from the show, does make some sense, as nomads would probably gather many different kinds of people on their travels. The Earth kingdom varies in nationality, and not much was really featured in the movie, so no comment there.
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Post by KAndrw on Jul 9, 2010 2:34:13 GMT -5
The "ong" pronunciation thing was utterly *Watch your language!* and annoying. As someone with a family member who is developmentally disabled, it really bothers me that the term '*Watch your language!*' has fallen back into popular use as an insult. Can I ask you (and in fact everybody) to try to train yourself to pick insults that don't marginalise vulnerable people and make them and their families feel subhuman? I guarantee that if you do, you'll make developmentally disabled people and their families feel a lot better about themselves and about you.
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Post by Maethius on Jul 9, 2010 9:40:01 GMT -5
KAndrw, while I agree with the issue of sensitivity and my heart goes out to those families and persons afflicted with mental or physical disabilities (my family suffers from it also, and I used to donate time to the Ronald McDonald House when I lived near one), technically the barb is accurate:
noun 1. a slowing down, diminution, or hindrance, as in a machine. 2. Slang: Disparaging . a. a mentally *Watch your language!* person. b. a person who is stupid, obtuse, or ineffective in some way.
Yes, it's insulting and when we are affected it can hurt deeper than intended, but as we ask others to moderate their sensitivity we also need to retain a thick skin. I just hope it helps a little that Epyon was using definition 2 B.
Incidentally, a perfect rendition of the MNS's movie is found in the series: Book 3- Fire, Chapter 17, "The Ember Island Players."
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Post by KAndrw on Jul 9, 2010 12:43:58 GMT -5
noun 1. a slowing down, diminution, or hindrance, as in a machine. 2. Slang: Disparaging . a. a mentally *Watch your language!* person. b. a person who is stupid, obtuse, or ineffective in some way. Yes, it's insulting and when we are affected it can hurt deeper than intended, but as we ask others to moderate their sensitivity we also need to retain a thick skin. I just hope it helps a little that Epyon was using definition 2 B. For starters, Epyon used it as an adjective, not a noun Furthermore, the fact that the 2b definition of disparaging slang exists does not make it any more or less acceptable, just as dictionary instances of n-bombs and the one-syllable abbreviation of 'japanese' don't make those terms universally legitimate. The use of '*Watch your language!*' as an insult doesn't hurt me - it just makes me think less of those who use it. While for most people it's just a habit picked up from other people and they don't personally mean or construe offense, the fact remains that it's an insult that works by leveraging the undesirability of a vulnerable population. I find the resurgence of using g- and f- synonyms for homosexual to describe negative things somewhat troubling as well, but I can explain that away by accepting that some people genuinely take offense at homosexuals on religious or cultural grounds. Since I can't think of any religions or cultures that find developmentally challenged people fundamentally offensive, the use of '*Watch your language!*', '*Watch your language!*' etc as insults just reflects a society that is becoming mean-spirited. That's why I try to do my bit to nip this particular lingual aberration in the bud
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